engine mounting bolt

hi all

i am in need of suggestions regarding the front engine mounting bolt. (the one beside the oil fiter) the spacer on one side has corroded away and i was going to replace both of them but the bolt is seized in the alluminium of the engine .

i have thought about heating the engine but i know heat and alluminuim do not go to great together and i was wondering if any one has had sucsses in getting this bolt out without damaging the engine ? i have left the bolt soaking over night in wd40 and tapped all parts with a hammer hoping the wd40 will penatrate ?

any suggestions are more than welcome regards colin

plus gas is supposed to be better than wd40 and heat will make the aluminium of the engine expand so it should work,you dont need to heat the engine to white hot,lol

thanks davetheworv

i think i will start with a hot air gun before i get a the flame out , i have spent 2 & 1/2 hours chisling off the other spacer thinking that this would aid the removal of the bolt but alas the bolt is still solid i have left a bar and socket on the bolt, tied under pressure till tomorrow. will let you all know how i get on regards colin

It's a pretty common problem but not one with an easy solution.
I had the same, so I spent a few days soaking the area with Plus-Gas and then,after heating up the area, used a metal bar of the same diameter as a drift, and a bloody great club hammer.
I was lucky, I got it out but it made me sweat.
I have heard of someone cutting the ends off the bolt and then drilling down the centre to weaken it and then drifting it out.
If you can, take it to an engineer who will have the right tools for the job, and if they break the casing at least you'll have some come-back on their insurance.
Regards,
Phil

I had the same problem when I swapped the engine in mine. After much cursing on my part I got a mate in a garage to do it, he heated the engine block and eventually it came out.

thanks phil and teamster1975

i sprayed vinager on the the bolt last night ,this morning ,and tonight and will try the bolt tomorrow after work then i think i wil try heating the casing as it is the next step to go ,, i have heard that if i rub a bar of soap around the area to be heated and when the soap goes black that is the time to stop the heat and work the bolt as the soap blackens the aluminium is at its hotest ????????? has anyone heard of this or can confirm this is in fact true regards colin

No idea about the soap part... I thought that was something about finding the right temperature for annealing.

Definatly a good idea to use the hot-air gun first but I fear it may not provide enough heat. Blow-lamp might be more appropriate, if used with a little caution.

It's also a good idea to spray in the plus-gas or whatever when it is still warm - helps the penetration.

thanks eternally_troubled

i have now spent aprox 10 hours on this bolt this week , i have heated the right hand side and the bolt is starting to move very slightly , i have been soaking the bolt with wd40 during the week and going to start heating the left hand side on saturday , wish me luck

smokiewazhere wrote:
i have now spent aprox 10 hours on this bolt this week , i have heated the right hand side and the bolt is starting to move very slightly , i have been soaking the bolt with wd40 during the week and going to start heating the left hand side on saturday , wish me luck :)

Unfortunatly, in my experience, sometimes *time* is exactly what these kind of things need.

Anyway, good luck!

eternally_troubled wrote:No idea about the soap part... I thought that was something about finding the right temperature for annealing.

Definatly a good idea to use the hot-air gun first but I fear it may not provide enough heat. Blow-lamp might be more appropriate, if used with a little caution.

It's also a good idea to spray in the plus-gas or whatever when it is still warm - helps the penetration.

Correct in all respects E.T. it's the annealing temperature when the soap turns black.

It looks like you're doing all the right things at the moment smokiewazhere so can't give any tips more than stated before. The problem you have is that the alloy on the engine case is acting as a sacrificial anode because it is more active electropositively than the steel of the bolt, and the alloy has expanded as it corroded.

To strike a positive note here, if it wasn't so, you'd have a very rusty engine bolt as well.

Scant comfort I know

thanks E T and chromedome

no update this weekend as i never had time to work on the cb500 as i was out on my pan on saturday , i have now ordered a pin point jet nozzle for the gas blow torch i bought as the torch came with a wide nozzle and the right hand side has that hose port near to it . i will give it another go this week sometime , time i have plenty of to get this bolt to move lol

just an update folks things have gotten worse the damn bolt has now broken at the right hand side so the next step is to remove the frame at the left hand side , remove the exhausts and the coolant pipes for more access and now i have a blow torch with a pin point flame i am going to attempt to heat the bolt till red hot and using a stud extractor on the nut side try and free it off ,

i will keep the forum updated as i go along , thanks for all your replies they are all welcome .



just found this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxhdFsrzSmY

god you watch some exciting stuff dont you? most people watch either music or porn,lol

OK, now one side of the bolt's broken off.....

Had similar in the past, and managed to push it through gradually by using a G clamp and a metal rod on the screw side. Had to place a couple of metal blocks as spacers on the static side to allow the bolt to slide out.

Might be worth a try, but I know that space is a bit limited here.

davetheworv wrote:god you watch some exciting stuff dont you? most people watch either music or porn,lol

nice reply davetheworv

saturday update

i have heated and cooled and heated and heated the engine and tried to pull the bolt out using the nut i had it torqued up to 100nm and then the threads stripped

so then i took the part of the frame off and got a stud extractor on the bloody bolt and guess what ..........the bloody bolt snapped again

so now i am in the process of removing the engine to drill out the bolt (the reason the engine is comming out is i don't have electric in my lock up)

the two rear mounting bolts are coming out very easily

gonna do some other work on the bike when the engine is out and is off the road now . got a new front disc to fit now and get the exhaust painted and the frame cleaned up ect

Good heavens, oh dear, WHAT a stubborn bolt.

I imagine at least that's what you were saying in your garage.

This is turning into a bit of a saga Smokie, and it's probably the most time spent on one bolt I've ever heard of.

Little bit of C4 should shift it. Reckon by this time it's turned personal.

Hope you get the little swine out.

further update on this bloody bolt folks

i have now taken the engine out and took it up to my house shed where i have electric .

i ground the ends of the bolt at each side flush with the casing and then proceded to drill in to the bolt . after measuring how deep into the bolt i was i increased the size of the drill step by step up to 8mm . i did this on both sides of the bolt and you've guessed it the bloody bolt still won't budge

i then decided to cut the bolt in half but then dicovered the grinder would not go right through the bolt as it started to touch the casing so i then started to cut along the bolt to cut through it ..... even then with drilling and cutting i had to chap it several hard blows to get the two parts out took me two and a half hours today .

now the bolt is out in pieces i now have the job of fitting the engine back in before i forget how it goes.

i would like to thank you all for your support and suggestions in my quest with this bolt

Glad you finally shifted the damm thing, but what a bleedin' palaver to get there.

You can now rest easy in your bed, satisfied in a job well done

Glad to hear you've finally on the way to getting it sorted.... getting the engine back in shouldn't be half as bad as getting the bolt out!

engine is back in the frame and now waiting on new bolt + nut ,exhaust rings,studs and nuts coming from david silvers

tried to start the bike without the exhaust on but it would not fire up it back fired a few times which made me jump as you can imagine, has anyone tried to start up the cb500 without the exhaust on or do i have another problem?

i checked the spark which is sparking ok and fuel is getting through ok

I haven't *started* the bike without the exhaust, but when one of my exhausts downpipes parted company with the engine, other than making a hell of a noise, it made the bike run quite badly, so I'm not surprised you can't get it to start easily.

Probably not worth getting worried until you get the exhaust back on ;)

thanks E-T i will wait on the parts coming and fit the exhaust . i have painted the whole exhaust with fortress paint from b&q tried it on a small section a while ago and seems to last better than the stove paint. i may regret doing it but only time will tell.

Is that fortress paint marketed as 'high temperature'? It might well be OK on the rear of the exhaust, but it will burn right off the front/downpipes if it isn't... I know this because I (like the idiot I am) painted my whole exhaust with (normal) hammerite - looked great, unfortunatly lasted about 5 mins and dissappeared in a large cloud of noxious smoke. Just don't start up the bike inside the garage ;)

i will start the bike up outside just incase thanks for that advise

when i did a test bit just at the start of the silencer i did notice there was a burn in period of fumes but after that it seemed to last better , just had a lookat the fortress site and it dose not state heat resistance paint so it may just burn of like the hammerite did?

i assume the paint on the front pipes will not last long due to the very high temp but hey hoe got to give it a try for the winter ,

i also made up a make shift mud flap from a piece of stiff boot mat whoch i have fitted to the front mud guard will see how this works to keep the road muck getting thown up on to this new engine bolt

exhaust now back on and the reason the bike would not start was the wires on the coils were round the wrong way .

after warming the bike up i found the cooling fan would not work, this was down to a bad earth , the radiator now has its own earth wire to the frame, and the cooling fan is now operating correctly.

i have noticed a big diffrence in the turning of the starter motor which to me seemed to be turning slowly as if the battery was run down slightly , after having the engine out and cleaning all the mounting bolts the starter now seems to have a new lease of life and is turning much quicker now which now makes the engine start instantly on pressing the start button

as for the exhaust as soon as the bike fired up the paint on the down pipes started to burn off as we thought it would , after a run for about 1 hour the paint is still ok where the twopipes go into one and all the way back to the end of the silencer, only time will tell how long it will last .

thanks for all the suggestions and banter on my quest with this bolt ,

LONG LIVE THE CB500